Spin off: Family Dynamics

[DonDaddyD]

Born out of the locked feminism thread I would like to discuss this topic in further detail.


Firstly I would like to ask the main questions:

What do you think it takes to make a Family unit?

Do Mothers and Fathers have specific roles i.e. the nurturer (Mother) and the provider (Father)?

If Mothers are able to raise children on their own are Fathers in fact needed?

Is Parenting gender specific?

Are Mothers generally closer too their children than the Fathers and are they naturally better Parents?

What makes a Parent?

I want to express where my perspective comes from.I was one of three black people in my secondary school to have not come from a single parent Family. When I went to Junior School (10 - 12), which had a larger ratio of black people, I was the ONLY black person to have a Dad. All my life I have seen the vast majority of single parent Mothers not being able to control their children (sons and daughters), I watched these relatively strong and respectable Women loosing their children too a society that is designed to see them fail. And as my London grew ever more closely into multiculture I have seen the same effects within the households of white single parent Families. This assumed negative effect was so devastating that a close friend’s parents decided to live together and sleep in the same bed for more than 10yrs in order to keep the secret that they had in fact spilt up years ago. They had decided to raise their children together under the same roof until both were 18 to ensure their children’s success. The parents now with two highly successful adult children have finally truly separated.

Without my own Father I myself may have fell under the sword had he and my Mother not worked together from a tender age, younger than I am now, to raise me.

I see the necessity and need for Men.

My society, my culture is screaming out for stronger male role models. So when I hear people say that ‘Men are not needed and that they bring little good to the Family’, I feel that my very life, my very core, soul, upbringing and subsequent values have been insulted. I would like those people to ‘walk a mile in my shoes’, then tell me how my life is and that I, my Father, my Grandfather (the greatest Man I know) or any other male in my family is not needed.

However, on a more personal level I know single parent Families to work as well. My Grandmother raised eight children on her own and each of her sons and daughters take great interest and passionate desire in being be good Parents too their children.

In society we are taught that a well balanced Family has both a Mother and Father adding to the greater whole. Yet although not the norm, time and again we have also seen Mothers capable of raising their children on their own. What does this say about the role of the man?

I do not believe that parenting is gender specific in that a Mother can only raise a daughter and Father's can only raise Sons. Yes there are issues that a daughter will feel more comfortable with approaching their Mother about (periods, makeup and such), but there is more between the bond and understanding of Parent and child than surface level things. I have also seen Father's and daughters able to talk about the above topics with no implied difficulties and this experience has shown me that such issues can be transcended if the two individuals can look past social doctrines and constraints. I also know first hand that Mothers can enjoy their sons as much as Fathers do.

This view however does not remove the notion that a single parent Family cannot be ‘successful’ but merely adds to it. Usually the social norm is that custody is given too the Mother as she is considered the better Parent (something I have deep rooted issues about). There are some Woman who can maintain the family structure on their own but I firmly believe this is dependant on how they found themselves to be on their own in the first place. I also believe that the success of a single parent is completely reliant on how well the person can adjust to the role of both the provider and nurturer and that has largely to do with how the Family became a single parent household and how the children perceive the situation.

Ultimately I couldn’t tell say what it takes to be a parent, I know that within my extended family I have Grandmothers, Grandfathers aunts and Uncles who I can look up as my Parents in addition too my Mum and Dad at no loss too the love and respect I have for my parents. And equally I have Grandmothers, Grandfathers aunts and Uncles who are what they are through biological means. I do not love them any less just that they have not transcending the role and formed that bond with me. That in itself isn’t through a lack of time spent, it is just that for me some individuals can embody the true meaning of a ‘Parent’ and others can’t even if they are Mothers and Fathers. Too that end I cannot tell you what it takes to be a parent or even a good one, I suppose it is something learnt through experience coupled with panache you have or you don’t.

 

[Buddy]

What do you think it takes to make a Family unit?
A family unit I feel is based on the structure that the Adults in the family provide. I know I said adults but it can be a single adult as well. This can range from how the Adults interact with each other to how they interact with other people or even pets. Since this seems to be a family unit including a child I must say that morals of the Adults are important to the family unit. The child when born is a blank slate, everything the adults do is basicly input to the child and shaped the childs thoughts and personality. With that said gender isnt allways an issue since most children dont understand gender till they reach about 8 to 9 years old so gender of the parents is not allways a factor. To have a working family unit I feel you need, morals, control, love and creativity. Its a good idea for the Family unit to do different things together thus giving the child a lot of different experiances as well as the adults doing different things so they dont get bored with each other which generally leads to fights and things of that nature.

Do Mothers and Fathers have specific roles i.e. the nurturer (Mother) and the provider (Father)?

No. Any role can be played by any person, if nessisary a father or mother can be both nurturing and a provider. I cant lie it is easier with two and alot of people feel that it would not be possible to provide a child with both from a single parent but its not true. Generally where a single parent situation goes wrong is when the parent (Mother or Father) gives up on themselves due to losing thier partner in what ever way happened and thus is not able to raise the child as well due to thier own emotional problems. In many situations there are men and women who are strong enough to move on and realize that thier child comes first and can put thier problems on hold. Since a single person can play both roles I dont think that the roles have to be played that way. However it does work when availible.

If Mothers are able to raise children on their own are Fathers in fact needed?

Not needed but helpful, its like working on your roof, yea you can do it by your self but its alot easier if someone is there to hold the ladder for you isnt it.

Is Parenting gender specific?

No see topic about specific roles.

Are Mothers generally closer too their children than the Fathers and are they naturally better Parents?

Completely dependant on the person, you can have a father who is really good with children and a mother who is fairly detached or vice versa. Generally people say Boys cling to mom and Girls cling to dad but its dependant on the person. I dont think either sex is naturally a better parent, its based on the person entirely on the person.

What makes a Parent?

A good person

 

[Black Widow]

Society as a whole is SUFFERING from a generation of absent fathers. Men [REAL men, not immoral, immature boys who THINK they are men for whatever reason] ARE needed in a family, most specifically a family with boys. While EITHER gender CAN and DO raise perfectly well adjusted children, its difficult to say women can show boys how to be men and that men can show girls how to be women. The truth IS... a women knows what a REAL man is, and can raise her son to behave that way, and VICE VERSA... but i strongly believe that in BOTH cases, the child will look outside the immediate household family to find a ROLE MODEL of the same sex. Without a father, a boy needs to see what a MAN is to be able to understand why his mother instills those virtues in him. Likewise, a daughter, while her father may be particularly apt at raising her to be strong and independant, needs a WOMAN in her life. It's part of emotional and psychological development of the child.

And that's not to say a son doesn't NEED a mother figure or a daughter doesnt need a father figure. BOTH parents are important to raise any child, and in a situation where only ONE is available, the child will [whether they realize it or not] seek a figure for the missing role model. While a mother raising a daughter is usually sufficient, a girl still needs to see how a real MAN might treat her mother and to learn how to relate to men. Vice versa, a boy needs to be exposed to women-- he needs to be taught respect of women and he needs to be able to interact with women who can help him understand what is ACCEPTABLE and what is not in regards to treatment of women.

 

[Osiris]

Please excuse me, but I can only answer these questions in the context of my Islamic beliefs.

What do you think it takes to make a Family unit?


Many things make up a family and many things can make up a unit. However, in the Original Nature and order of things a Family unit consists of a Father and a Mother and their children if any. This is necessary because the man and the woman are but a single creation each posess 1/2 of the other, and only together can both in essence become one.

As we are taught in Islam, men and women are the garments of one another and in order to be secure and safe one must be "covered" by the other. It is for this reason that the Prophet of Islam(saw) stated that "Marriage is 1/2 of your deen(religion)" because without the one who is half of our creation we can only aspire to be 50% or 1/2 of the human potential.

Whenever we don't have the above, human nature requires us to "substitute", while this may be successful in some cases in others it is not. Truth be told, I believe society would be better off as a whole with the above mentioned formula in place. I didnt come from such a family and I firmly believe that is why my life took the course it did. However, Masha' Allah(it was the will of God) and all must deal with the cards they were dealt.


Do Mothers and Fathers have specific roles i.e. the nurturer (Mother) and the provider (Father)?


Certainly. However, while roles can change i.e. Dad stays at home while mom goes to work, our original Nature does not. We are taught that Men are the maintainers of women, while some may think of this in financial terms only, that is not necessarily the case, however our Natures are different in the sense that women are better equipped to nurture, teach, and take care of home, men are better equipped to provide and make things secure. These are our Natures, but not necessarily our roles.

If Mothers are able to raise children on their own are Fathers in fact needed?


Many things are "able" to happen, because with God nothing is impossible. After all we all are god(s) and goddesses. However, there is always going to be a little something missing, because we are not in complete balance until we become one with one another, so that is why men are needed. That is why in Eastern philosophy you never have a god without a goddess or a ying without a yang, the universe is one of balance and order and it cannot become "one" without the opposites in place. One can change or modify the goal and objectives as to what it means to be "one", but our original self is just compesating for what we don't have.

Is Parenting gender specific?

No. The goal of every parent should be to raise their child in the best manner they know how and can, to ensure they grow into healthy and productive adults.

Are Mothers generally closer too their children than the Fathers and are they naturally better Parents?


"Closer" is a subjective term. I believe both parents fill a specific role or duty in a childs life so the parenting aspect is also subjective, because if Mom's duty is A, B, and C, and Dad's is D, E, and F, the two can't truly be compared. As far as better parentage, that's impossible to gauge as well, because in the absence of either parent, we find ourselves trying to make A, B, C, D, E, and F happen, no matter what.

I doubt any parent male or female would feel exempt from fulfilling roles just because the other parent is around to do them. When a job has to be done by two people if you can't go home until the work is done, do you just finish your work and wait on the other person or do you help that person or do the job if necessary in order to go home?

What makes a Parent?


Anyone with the capacity to love in a way that makes them understand and are willing to fulfill the duties necessary to ensure that children become productive and self-sufficient members of society.

 

[Lawless]

What do you think it takes to make a Family unit?
I think everyone will agree that it is preferable to have both parents present in a nurturing and loving environment. But the bare bones essential isn’t necessarily one parent over the other just the dynamics between them; ie the love, honesty, and nurturing.

Do Mothers and Fathers have specific roles i.e. the nurturer (Mother) and the provider (Father)?
I think from the single parent perspective which ever parent is raising the child will always be a provider, the iffy part is how much of nurturer they are. With both parents present no there shouldn’t be a role, instilling a role instills the differences which a couple of them I think are unavoidable enough as it is without ‘engendering’ them with roles.

If Mothers are able to raise children on their own are Fathers in fact needed?
Needed no but a father can raise a child without the mother, so neither are technically needed just as long as one of them is present to actually do the job (kids are work). The problem most non-independently wealthy single parents have is managing time between working to provide and working to nurture. More often than not providing tends to take the priority at which point kids are left to figure things out for themselves and fend for themselves (Classic latch-key kids). As part of the overall condition of the modern world, money has become a more important factor in happiness and the ability of a single parent to raise a ‘healthy’ child. Kids need the X-Boxes and cell phones don’t you know.

There is also the dynamic by which a single parent becomes a single parent. In my life I have honestly seen nearly every version of the single parent, (father/daughter, mother/daughter, mother/son, father/son, father/both-multiple, mother/both-multiple). If the parents aren’t together on good terms it can be less than stellar for the child. If the parent is angry with the absent partner then odds are the child will be also and imprint that on their gender. Of course the flip side is the daddy’s girl and momma’s boy, which aren’t good either, one could end up looking for a provider other looking for something to take care of.

Is Parenting gender specific?
Yes and no. Beyond the mother’s instinct to feed a newborn not necessarily. Granted there are many animals where the mother alone raises the child but not necessarily in dominate numbers. In nature there are countless species of animals where both parents are present and often switching supposed roles.

Are Mothers generally closer too their children than the Fathers and are they naturally better Parents?
Better? Nope, there are too many screwed up people in the world for one sex to be better at parenting than the other. Closer, tough call. If men were closer they’d leave less often or at least help more to raise the child, but is that society or nature.

What makes a Parent?
Knowledge, wisdom, and the capacity to love and be honest, as far as humans go anyway.

 

[Rampage]

What do you think it takes to make a Family unit?

At least one loving parent and a child. If you can have two, it helps A LOT.

Do Mothers and Fathers have specific roles i.e. the nurturer (Mother) and the provider (Father)?

Not necessarily. This depends on the relationship. There are women who out-earn their husbands and there are fatheres who are more nurturing. In my home I believe that we are more in the classic roles but it has to do with our relationship, not with enforcing any status quo.

If Mothers are able to raise children on their own are Fathers in fact needed?

Yes. One parent (Mother OR Father) can raise achild, but when there are two parents there is a sharing of the job, a reinforcement of values and an example of how to get along with another person and how to treat and demand quality treatment from the iopposite sex. Ideally all of these things are reinforced with two parents in a way that is more difficult for one parent.

Is Parenting gender specific?

No. men and women can both parent. It takes love and dedication.

Are Mothers generally closer too their children than the Fathers and are they naturally better Parents?

I will say that the biological connection that women have with their children does give them an advantage in this regard, but if the desire to parent is lacking, then that advantage is for naught. I know lots of fathers who are better parents to their children.

What makes a Parent?

Love, devotion, discipline, values, desire, and patience man, patience.

 

[ZorCrow]

Please excuse me, but I can only answer these questions in the context of my Islamic beliefs.

What do you think it takes to make a Family unit?


Many things make up a family and many things can make up a unit. However, in the Original Nature and order of things a Family unit consists of a Father and a Mother and their children if any. This is necessary because the man and the woman are but a single creation each posess 1/2 of the other, and only together can both in essence become one.

As we are taught in Islam, men and women are the garments of one another and in order to be secure and safe one must be "covered" by the other. It is for this reason that the Prophet of Islam(saw) stated that "Marriage is 1/2 of your deen(religion)" because without the one who is half of our creation we can only aspire to be 50% or 1/2 of the human potential.

Whenever we don't have the above, human nature requires us to "substitute", while this may be successful in some cases in others it is not. Truth be told, I believe society would be better off as a whole with the above mentioned formula in place. I didnt come from such a family and I firmly believe that is why my life took the course it did. However, Masha' Allah(it was the will of God) and all must deal with the cards they were dealt.


Do Mothers and Fathers have specific roles i.e. the nurturer (Mother) and the provider (Father)?


Certainly. However, while roles can change i.e. Dad stays at home while mom goes to work, our original Nature does not. We are taught that Men are the maintainers of women, while some may think of this in financial terms only, that is not necessarily the case, however our Natures are different in the sense that women are better equipped to nurture, teach, and take care of home, men are better equipped to provide and make things secure. These are our Natures, but not necessarily our roles.

If Mothers are able to raise children on their own are Fathers in fact needed?


Many things are "able" to happen, because with God nothing is impossible. After all we all are god(s) and goddesses. However, there is always going to be a little something missing, because we are not in complete balance until we become one with one another, so that is why men are needed. That is why in Eastern philosophy you never have a god without a goddess or a ying without a yang, the universe is one of balance and order and it cannot become "one" without the opposites in place. One can change or modify the goal and objectives as to what it means to be "one", but our original self is just compesating for what we don't have.

Is Parenting gender specific?

No. The goal of every parent should be to raise their child in the best manner they know how and can, to ensure they grow into healthy and productive adults.

Are Mothers generally closer too their children than the Fathers and are they naturally better Parents?


"Closer" is a subjective term. I believe both parents fill a specific role or duty in a childs life so the parenting aspect is also subjective, because if Mom's duty is A, B, and C, and Dad's is D, E, and F, the two can't truly be compared. As far as better parentage, that's impossible to gauge as well, because in the absence of either parent, we find ourselves trying to make A, B, C, D, E, and F happen, no matter what.

I doubt any parent male or female would feel exempt from fulfilling roles just because the other parent is around to do them. When a job has to be done by two people if you can't go home until the work is done, do you just finish your work and wait on the other person or do you help that person or do the job if necessary in order to go home?

What makes a Parent?


Anyone with the capacity to love in a way that makes them understand and are willing to fulfill the duties necessary to ensure that children become productive and self-sufficient members of society.

Great post . . I concur . .

 

[ZorCrow]

[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times] [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] This is a WorldNetDaily printer-friendly version of the article which follows.
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[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]Saturday, June 3, 2006
[/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times][FONT=Palatino,][SIZE=+2]Boys from single-parent homes have sex earlier[/FONT]
[FONT=Palatino,][SIZE=+1]New CDC report shows importance of keeping families intact[/SIZE][/FONT]
[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times][SIZE=-1]Posted: June 3, 2006
1:00 a.m. Eastern

Editor's note: "THE WAR ON FATHERS," the June edition of WND's popular Whistleblower magazine, is an in-depth, cover-to-cover investigative report on how misguided feminism is destroying America's boys, men – and women. [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times][SIZE=-1] © 2006 WorldNetDaily.com [/SIZE][/FONT]

Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in Atlanta [FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]A Centers for Disease Control report this week shows boys from single-parent households are much more likely to have sex by age 15 than boys who live in two-parent families. [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]The CDC study, which interviewed nearly 5,000 males aged 15-44, focused on their sexual attitudes and behavior. [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]It found that one-in-four boys from single-parent households were likely to have sex, compared to one-in-seven in two-parent households. [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]Janice Shaw Crouse of Concerned Women for America says the latest report "confirms what we already know." [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]"While most single parents work hard to meet their children's needs and many are able to beat the odds, single-parent households put children from babies through teens at risk for a broad spectrum of problems," she said. [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times] [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]Crouse -- author of CWA's Data Digests, a quarterly publication that report on social science data and its impact on children, women and families -- pointed out, however, the authors of the study downplayed the basic finding of the report. [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]That is, she said, that boys of single-parents are more likely to have sex even though they are uncertain or don't want to. [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]"But the truth is that children need a father's presence and influence," she said. "Father-absence is a major contributing factor to many of the social problems afflicting the nation's children." [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]Other findings include: [/FONT]

• [FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]
  [*]More than a quarter of the white males and over 40 percent of the black males were either uncertain or did not want to have intercourse the first time they had sex.
  [*]About half of the men who did not graduate from high school have had an out-of-wedlock child, compared to only 6 percent of college graduates.
  [*]About a quarter of black men had a child before age 20 compared to slightly more than 10 percent of the white men.[/FONT]

[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]The report by lead author Gladys Martinez, "Fertility, Contraception, and Fatherhood: Data on Men and Women from Cycle 6 of the 2002 National Survey of Family Growth" was published in Vital and Health Statistics. [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]Related offer: [/FONT]
[FONT=palatino, times new roman, georgia, times]In honor of Fathers Day, the June edition of Whistleblower magazine is a mega-eye-opener exploring one of the most crucial but little-reported phenomena of modern America – what WND calls "THE WAR ON FATHERS." [/FONT]
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[Mat]

What do you think it takes to make a Family unit?
A family unit to me is just a group of people bonded by their appreciation for one another. Screen-gems is, in a way, a family unit.

Do Mothers and Fathers have specific roles i.e. the nurturer (Mother) and the provider (Father)?
Nah, and anyone who tells you that they have specific roles needs to wake up. A single parent has to do both, and even if he/she is a bad parent, it's possible that a mother could be a provider but not a nurturer, or a father a nurturer or not a provider. I don't even want to go so far as to say either gender is better at either of the two roles - I've met some incredibly sweet mothers who are excellent homemakers but I've met some really frigid ones, too.

If Mothers are able to raise children on their own are Fathers in fact needed?
I find this question especially interesting because I was raised by my father, not my mother. Personally I think you only *need* one parent. The gender doesn't matter so much as your mother's/father's integrity; one good person can raise another one.

Is Parenting gender specific?
No.

Are Mothers generally closer to their children than the Fathers and are they naturally better Parents?
I think most mothers are closer to their children, though in a lot of ways how close you become to your parents depends on what you end-up having in common with them. I've met plenty of girls who can't get along with their mothers. On the other end of the spectrum, I've had female friends who talk to their mother everyday on the phone and are extremely close (I avoid dating women like this at all costs because it's
usually a warning sign you're going to be a relationship where two women's opinions matter <shudders>).

What makes a Parent?

A parent is someone who can provide for a child into their young adulthood. I don't just mean monetarily speaking, I mean emotionally as well.

 

[eponinethen]

What do you think it takes to make a Family unit?
A group of people (2-???) who care enough about each other to stand each other no matter (almost) what. This is usually easier if it happens to be people whom you've grown up with etc., since you are probably already used to their "faults" etc. and can overlook those things more easily..

Do Mothers and Fathers have specific roles i.e. the nurturer (Mother) and the provider (Father)?
In our society, obviously, yes, unfortunately. I am always happy to see signs that these roles are disappearing though, and "gender roles" isn't something I have ever (or will ever) believe in..

If Mothers are able to raise children on their own are Fathers in fact needed?
'Course they are. Fathers can be as great parents as mothers. Again, in our society mothers usually take on the "nurturing" role, but that doesn't mean men can do that thing just as good. But yeah, I don't think fathers are always needed, but mothers aren't either in all situations..

Is Parenting gender specific?
Not in my opinion no.

Are Mothers generally closer too their children than the Fathers and are they naturally better Parents?
Probably. But again, that's got to do with our society, how men have been taught how to be parents etc., which can make them a bit more distant to their children.. Obviously especially if the father is the provider etc. But I have no doubt that fathers can be (and are in some families) just as close or closer to their children than the mothers are..

What makes a Parent?
Someone who cares enough to love no matter what, and put their child before themselves at most times? (Hey I'd suck as a parent..)